visitor centre to open in July

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-27701384

The new expanded Richard III museum thingy in Leicester is to open in about six weeks.

I can't, off hand, think of any other British monarch who has a whole museum (even quite a little one) dedicated just to them. Can anybody?

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England's last warrior king.

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Not entirely! One of the Georges fought in battle - just not on British soil. Come to that, didn't Charles I fight? He certainly commanded.

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But that George didn't pick up a sword once he became king, IIRC. And Charles may have commanded, but he didn't put his body on the line the way Richard did. (And as Tydder stopped doing after Bosworth.)

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khafara wrote:: But that George didn't pick up a sword once he became king, IIRC. And Charles may have commanded, but he didn't put his body on the line the way Richard did. (And as Tydder stopped doing after Bosworth.)

George II was the last British monarch to lead his troops in battle - Dettingen in 1743. He fought on horseback and of course ran the risk of being killed.

Subject: Re: visitor centre to open in July Sun 08 Jun 2014, 09:55

Hi there 's the Victoria & Albert Museum

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Yes, but that is not dedicated to V & A themselves, but to art and stuff like that.

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Henry VII's in York? Or is he only riding on Richard's tunic-tails? If tunics had tails....

I'm surprised the sainted Elizabeth II doesn't have her own museum, the raptures people go into over her.

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Wednesday wrote:: Henry VII's in York? Or is he only riding on Richard's tunic-tails? If tunics had tails....

I'm surprised the sainted Elizabeth II doesn't have her own museum, the raptures people go into over her.

If you do mean Elizabeth II and not Elizabeth I, she is well respected and personally liked by very large numbers of people, even in countries where monarchies are not the form of government - see the reaction in France this weekend.

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Thibault wrote:

Wednesday wrote:: Henry VII's in York? Or is he only riding on Richard's tunic-tails? If tunics had tails....

I'm surprised the sainted Elizabeth II doesn't have her own museum, the raptures people go into over her.

If you do mean Elizabeth II and not Elizabeth I, she is well respected and personally liked by very large numbers of people, even in countries where monarchies are not the form of government - see the reaction in France this weekend.

Gah! I meant E1, not E2. Elizabeth II deserves the raptures. I've never been so sure about Elizabeth I, considering her cutting off men's hands and such.... Mea culpa for the typo.

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I was almost sure you meant E I, but there have been some really unpleasant remarks about the Queen on some Ricardian sites over the legal case regarding Richard's reburial, so I wanted to make sure.

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I think that's my point - I mean, that EI is an object of great fascination and admiration (even if some of her behaviour is quite questionable), but she still doesn't have a museum. Henry has a little bit but, as you say, largely "because he was Richard's opponent", not in his own right.

Many years ago somebody I knew said that in the distant future, when all our current countries are ancient history, "There will be only two kings of England - there will be Arthur, and there will be Richard".

I suspect EI and Victoria and maybe Boudicca will be remembered as well, and of course Arthur, if he existed, was probably Welsh or Cornish, but the basic principle stands. Richard, with his two-year-reign, has a massive presence and charisma most other monarchs lack. And it isn't all post-mortem and due to the controversy. There's a guard-room at Penrith castle where some contemporary hand has carved his name into the wall, the way people nowadays spray-paint the names of football teams or rock stars. The only more recent historical figures I can think of who have that sort of rock star popularity are Bonnie Prince Charlie (even though he ended his days as a sad drunk), and Nelson.

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But, I would argue, Richard has 'presence' among modern people because of the Shakespeare play - that is what most people think of when asked about Richard (obviously I am excluding Ricardians and history buffs in general) - the limp, the hump, the killing etc. The people who know him via the play do not know the man, nor experience his charisma, rather they admire/or are fascinated by a great villain.

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To some extent, yes, and also because most people nowadays (most people in the UK, anyway) know he may be the victim of a miscarriage of justice, or at least that his history is disputed. But Richard seems to have been hugely charismatic in his lifetime, as well as after death - and Shakespeare wrote about many kings. There isn't a Macbeth museum and a vast body of Macbeth-themed romances, although he was equally villainous in the plays, and is equally the victim of a miscarriage of justice.

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